Interview series: innovation for sustainability

Earlier in 2022 I conducted a series of interviews for a Masters module in the UCL Institute for Sustainable Resources. The interviewees were kind enough to allow me to put them into the public domain. This post covers the background, selecting interviewees, the questions, how we used them and a request for more interviewees.

Latest episode

Anna Birney: Multi-Level Perspective case study – Innovation for sustainability (for UCL Institute for Sustainable Resources Masters)

Dr Anna Birney is CEO (Chief Executive / Enabling / Evolving Officer) of The School of System Change, which enables personal and collective agency to cultivate change in the world with a multi-method approach to systems change learning – with networks, organisations and individuals (Anna's LinkedIn, Medium and Twitter).This episode is a little unusual. We dive into the Multi-Level Perspective ('MLP'), one of the leading theories of system transition which we teach in the module (here for the Wikipedia explanation). MLP has been used in academic research for the last decade or so. However, there are not a lot of good case studies of using MLP for change. The #OneLess project, run by Anna when she was at Forum for the Future, is a rare example. Anna uses slides to explain the story. You can watch the presentation on YouTube here and download the slides here.Through the course of the interview, we cover (amongst other things):-Sustainability as "finding the collective of capability to address a complex world and a changing world".-All models are wrong, just some are more useful than others.-How the OneLess project came out of the Marine CoLABoration, funded by the Calouste Gulbenkian Foundation.-The standard 'story' of change in MLP: the macro level ('Landscape')  trends put pressure on the mainstream ('Regime'), which has been dynamically stable but now is struggling, making space for mature new innovations to come in from the bottom level ('Niche').-Part of the practice of systemic change is paying attention the the boundaries you are choosing, because there is a dance between the boundaries people believe form the system and what interventions can act with that system.-Four different uses of MLP in the proejct:  1. As a frame of research questions to understand the challenge.  2., As a diagnostic analysis of the dynamics.   3. Create a strategy for systemic impact.  4. To keep on testing assumptions against experiences. -Relating the project to the Taxonomy of Innovation used in the Module.-The importance of keeping an experimental mindset, and to be actively learning-by-testing.-Also, the importance of having a portfolio of interventions of different types, each justified by the underpinning rationale provided by MLP; not just relying on technological silver bullets.This is part of a series of interviews about innovation for sustainability conducted for the UCL Institute for Sustainable Resources, as a contribution to a module in this Masters. You can find out more about these interviews, and the module, here.

1. Anna Birney: Multi-Level Perspective case study 30:41
2. Molly Webb 47:59
3. Sarah Goodenough 47:00
4. Paul Miller 37:11
5. Stuart Wilkinson 30:28

Background

In autumn 2021 I was asked to co-lead a module for the UCL Institute for Sustainable Resources (UCL ISR) by Prof Paul Ekins (who I knew from my time at Forum for the Future). I jumped at the chance: to get my own thinking in order, to engage with the students, and to learn from the other co-lead. Dr Will McDowall (LinkedIn) is an Associate Professor, with great work on the policy and macro side of innovation (especially on energy).

The module is in the Masters in Sustainable Resources: Economics, Policy and Transitions, and has the slightly out-of-date title of ‘Eco-Innovation and Sustainable Entrepreneurship’ (UCL code: BENV0077).

It is essentially on the intersection of business, innovation and sustainability.

Will and I got together and immediately could see the benefits of combining his academic depth with my practitioner experience. When we went through the syllabus I realised that there was something missing we could address: the practitioner voice.

The interviews are with people who are putting innovation for sustainability into practice. We wanted to give students the grit under the fingernails of real experience.

Selecting interviewees

I wanted to get a spread across different dimensions of ‘innovation for sustainability’:

• Type of innovation*: Product, Process, Paradigm, Position.
• Motivation for innovation: for-profit; for-benefit; and public body.
• Industrial sectors: especially ones judged hard to act on climate, highly regulated or are highly influential.
• Role in innovation: generating new things; incubating entrepreneurs; supporting innovation ecosystems.
• Location: get beyond Europe and the USA.

As you will hear, across the first batch of 7 interviews we did quite well across these ranges. I did this by asking all my various networks, plus putting a request out on Twitter.

A huge thank you to all the people said yes and then took part. I learnt from them (as did the students). I hope they gained from the experience too.

*4Ps typology adapted from p25 Bessant, J.R. & Tidd, J. 2013. Managing innovation: integrating technological, market and organizational change:

• Product – Product innovation refers to making positive changes to the goods or services offered by a business
• Process- Process innovation occurs when changes are made to how a business creates and delivers its goods or services
• Position – Position innovation relates to the context in which a product or service is marketed and sold.
• Paradigm – Paradigm innovation occurs when a company changes the underlying mental models that frame what it does.

The questions

The interviews were conducted by David Bent, the practitioner co-lead of the module. The academic co-lead is Dr Will McDowall, Associate Professor at the UCL ISR

In all the interviews, which were conducted via Zoom, we wanted to do a few different things:

• Understand their framing and motivations. This is covered in the intro and organisation setting.
• Have a real example, which we could get our teeth into. Hence the request for an innovation story.
• Step back and understand how they go about ‘innovation for sustainability’. This is covered in the innovation management section.
• Finally, what’s next. Tell us about the future.

PERSONAL AND ORGANISATIONAL INTRO
1. What is your role and organisation?

ORGANISATIONAL SETTING
2. What role does your department / function have in the organisation? What is expected from you? How does that connect to the organisation’s strategy?
3. How is ‘sustainability’ framed in your organisation? (For instance: are there specific key words or phrases? Is it only environmental?)

INNOVATION STORY
4. Can you tell us the story of a good example of your work on innovation for sustainability?

INNOVATION MANAGEMENT
5. What are the key methods and practices you use for innovation for sustainability?
6. What are the biggest challenges you face, and how do you overcome them?
7. If there was one thing policymakers could do which would make your work significantly easier, what would that be?

THE FUTURE
8. What are your organisation’s priorities on innovation going forward and why?

How we used them

We released the first interviews to the students through the UCL teaching website (‘Moodle’) about half way through the ten week module. We gradually added more each week. Then in week 8 we had a 1 hour session on the interviews, with me picking out key points from each and the students responding with their own thoughts and insights.

The student feedback on the whole course said things like “very much enjoyed the podcasts”. And after some of the classes the students spoke to me about having listened and got stuff out of them.

A request for more interviewees

Will and I are planning the module for the next Spring term 2023 (yes, already). I’d love to speak with more people on the practicalities and realities of innovating for sustainability.

I’m especially keen to speak with:

• Entrepreneurs with sustainability-aligned businesses who are for-profit.
• Early stage investors, again who are looking on sustainability as a business opportunity.
• Foundations or other for-impact actors who are trying to build innovation ecosystems.
• Anyone innovation for sustainability from the Majority World / Global South.

If that could be you, or someone you know, please email me on d.bent[at]ucl.ac.uk (sorry to not make that a link, but want to avoid spambots).